7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
- CanadianNC
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24 Jun 2016 00:52 #76525
by CanadianNC
7180+7i77 Spindle Problems was created by CanadianNC
Hi,
I'm most of the way through a huge retrofit of a machine and the last thing to get up and running is the spindle. I have it connected to the CW and CCW outputs as well as analogout05 on the 7i77 card but all that happens when I turn on the spindle is that it goes to the minimum VFD speed and stays there. No voltage is present across analogout05. I did a bunch of searches on this and I keep seeing people talk about using:
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs => hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.spinout
but when I use that instead of analogout05 Linuxcnc won't even load and it says that that line can't be loaded. My spindle doesn't have an encoder so no PID but I'm not sure which lines I need and which ones I don't so I left them all in there.
Can anyone give me some pointers on how to get this stuff up and running?
Thanks!
I'm most of the way through a huge retrofit of a machine and the last thing to get up and running is the spindle. I have it connected to the CW and CCW outputs as well as analogout05 on the 7i77 card but all that happens when I turn on the spindle is that it goes to the minimum VFD speed and stays there. No voltage is present across analogout05. I did a bunch of searches on this and I keep seeing people talk about using:
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs => hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.spinout
but when I use that instead of analogout05 Linuxcnc won't even load and it says that that line can't be loaded. My spindle doesn't have an encoder so no PID but I'm not sure which lines I need and which ones I don't so I left them all in there.
#*******************
# SPINDLE S
#*******************
setp pid.s.Pgain [SPINDLE_9]P
setp pid.s.Igain [SPINDLE_9]I
setp pid.s.Dgain [SPINDLE_9]D
setp pid.s.bias [SPINDLE_9]BIAS
setp pid.s.FF0 [SPINDLE_9]FF0
setp pid.s.FF1 [SPINDLE_9]FF1
setp pid.s.FF2 [SPINDLE_9]FF2
setp pid.s.deadband [SPINDLE_9]DEADBAND
setp pid.s.maxoutput [SPINDLE_9]MAX_OUTPUT
setp pid.s.error-previous-target true
net spindle-index-enable <=> pid.s.index-enable
net spindle-enable => pid.s.enable
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs => pid.s.command
net spindle-vel-fb-rpm-abs => pid.s.feedback
net spindle-output => pid.s.output
# ---PWM Generator signals/setup---
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-scalemax [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_SCALE
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-minlim [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_MIN_LIMIT
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-maxlim [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs => hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5
net spindle-enable hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.spinena
# ---setup spindle control signals---
net spindle-vel-cmd-rps <= motion.spindle-speed-out-rps
net spindle-vel-cmd-rps-abs <= motion.spindle-speed-out-rps-abs
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm <= motion.spindle-speed-out
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs <= motion.spindle-speed-out-abs
net spindle-enable <= motion.spindle-on
net spindle-cw <= motion.spindle-forward
net spindle-ccw <= motion.spindle-reverse
net spindle-brake <= motion.spindle-brake
net spindle-revs => motion.spindle-revs
net spindle-at-speed => motion.spindle-at-speed
net spindle-vel-fb-rps => motion.spindle-speed-in
net spindle-index-enable <=> motion.spindle-index-enable#********************
# Spindle
#********************
[SPINDLE_9]
P = 0.0
I = 0.0
D = 0.0
FF0 = 1.0
FF1 = 0.0
FF2 = 0.0
BIAS = 0.0
DEADBAND = 0.0
MAX_OUTPUT = 17500
OUTPUT_SCALE = 17500
OUTPUT_MIN_LIMIT = 0
OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT = 10Can anyone give me some pointers on how to get this stuff up and running?
Thanks!
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24 Jun 2016 01:32 #76527
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
Try setting your OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT limit to 17500
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24 Jun 2016 01:49 #76530
by CanadianNC
Replied by CanadianNC on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
I already tried that change but I still didn't measure anything on the analog output. How does Linuxcnc know that it's a 0-10V analog vs 0-5 or something like that if I make that change?
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24 Jun 2016 04:19 #76535
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
That change is necessary but maybe not sufficient (there may be additional errors)
The analog outputs are +-10V full scale
if you change the OUTPUT_SCALE value you must change the limits
if you have a output scale of 17500 RPM and a limit of 10 RPM you will have a
maximum output voltage of ~.0006V (10/17500)
So there may well be other issues with the spindle control but the analog output limits were too low
Can you post your complete hal and ini files here?
The analog outputs are +-10V full scale
if you change the OUTPUT_SCALE value you must change the limits
if you have a output scale of 17500 RPM and a limit of 10 RPM you will have a
maximum output voltage of ~.0006V (10/17500)
So there may well be other issues with the spindle control but the analog output limits were too low
Can you post your complete hal and ini files here?
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24 Jun 2016 12:21 #76544
by CanadianNC
Replied by CanadianNC on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
Here are my INI and HAL files.
Would you mind giving me a quick explanation of the parameters, because I don't quite understand why there's a Max_output AND a output_max_limit parameter, they seem like they would do the same thing.
MAX_OUTPUT = 17500
OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT = 10
Thanks!
Would you mind giving me a quick explanation of the parameters, because I don't quite understand why there's a Max_output AND a output_max_limit parameter, they seem like they would do the same thing.
MAX_OUTPUT = 17500
OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT = 10
Thanks!
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24 Jun 2016 12:51 - 24 Jun 2016 12:52 #76547
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
They do similar things, MAX_OUTPUT bounds the PID output (the spindle PID is setup but currently unused)
and OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT bounds the actual _scaled_ analog output
As I said before OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT must be 17500 or you will have a .6 mV maximum output if your scaling is 17500 RPM full scale
Here are the relevant statements in the hal file (unimportant statements deleled for clarity)
#*******************
# SPINDLE S
#*******************
setp pid.s.maxoutput [SPINDLE_9]MAX_OUTPUT
(note that the spindle PID loop is setup but not used so MAX_OUTPUT is dont-care)
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-scalemax [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_SCALE
This sets the analog out full scale value (so 17500 = 10V analog out)
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-minlim [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_MIN_LIMIT
this sets the scaled analog output minimum value
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-maxlim [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT
This sets the scaled analog output maximum value
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs => hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5
net spindle-enable hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.spinena
net spindle-enable <= motion.spindle-on
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs <= motion.spindle-speed-out-abs
and OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT bounds the actual _scaled_ analog output
As I said before OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT must be 17500 or you will have a .6 mV maximum output if your scaling is 17500 RPM full scale
Here are the relevant statements in the hal file (unimportant statements deleled for clarity)
#*******************
# SPINDLE S
#*******************
setp pid.s.maxoutput [SPINDLE_9]MAX_OUTPUT
(note that the spindle PID loop is setup but not used so MAX_OUTPUT is dont-care)
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-scalemax [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_SCALE
This sets the analog out full scale value (so 17500 = 10V analog out)
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-minlim [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_MIN_LIMIT
this sets the scaled analog output minimum value
setp hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5-maxlim [SPINDLE_9]OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT
This sets the scaled analog output maximum value
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs => hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5
net spindle-enable hm2_7i80.0.7i77.0.1.spinena
net spindle-enable <= motion.spindle-on
net spindle-vel-cmd-rpm-abs <= motion.spindle-speed-out-abs
Last edit: 24 Jun 2016 12:52 by PCW.
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24 Jun 2016 13:28 #76553
by CanadianNC
Replied by CanadianNC on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
Thanks! That was a very helpful explanation.
So correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like the only thing wrong with my files was having 10 instead of 17500 for the output_max_limit?
I guess this points to my VFD maybe not looking for an external signal to set the speed... I'll have to look into that.
Thanks again!
So correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like the only thing wrong with my files was having 10 instead of 17500 for the output_max_limit?
I guess this points to my VFD maybe not looking for an external signal to set the speed... I'll have to look into that.
Thanks again!
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24 Jun 2016 13:35 - 24 Jun 2016 14:01 #76555
by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
Its the only thing that i noticed being wrong in the spindle setup
Last edit: 24 Jun 2016 14:01 by PCW. Reason: sp
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24 Jun 2016 16:05 #76582
by CanadianNC
Replied by CanadianNC on topic 7180+7i77 Spindle Problems
Thanks for all of your help, the spindle is now working under machine controlled speed. A combination of the settings in the VFD and the number I had wrong in the INI file seemed to be the root of everything.
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