GUI that somewhat resembles haas or fanuc workflow.

Hey yall. Im a machinist by trade. I initially learned cnc on linuxcnc about 10y ago. Now I run "Real" cnc machines using fanuc and Haas. Initially I missed linuxcnc, but now when I go back and use my little linux mill, I am annoyed by the tool table and just the "PC" feel in general. The Fanuc soft keys are actually super nice and you can quickly go between work offsets, tool offsets ect. I can for example go to my absolute position page, do some mental math, type a number in the control, switch pages to my offsets, and input+ that number in seconds to quickly set offsets and stuff. No need for a mouse or anything silly like that. Hass is very similar but its even better with dedicated buttons to kick into the offsets or positions pages. Honestly the mouse is a major pain in a shop environment. The fanuc/Hass button based interaction is crazy fast for me compared to scrolling around on linuxcnc. suggestions? also itd be nice to get rid of the X Y tool offset and just have length/wear and diameter/wear. is there an "industrial GUI" im missing out on?

yeah touch screen would work. But what happens when some drops of coolant hit it and it freaks out. my phone is bad enough with a tiny drip of water. I wonder if itd be worth making a custom keyboard and special mapping some keys. QTdragon looks nice. I may give it a try. 

Kieran wrote:

yeah touch screen would work. But what happens when some drops of coolant hit it and it freaks out. my phone is bad enough with a tiny drip of water. I wonder if itd be worth making a custom keyboard and special mapping some keys. QTdragon looks nice. I may give it a try. 
 

Look for a resistive touch screen.  They're a little harder to find nowdays, but they are significantly less likely to trigger from a drop of coolant, errant fly, or other unintended activation.  Downside is they're a little scratch prone and aren't as bright or crisp as the more modern touch tech.

There are no 'industrial' GUI's currently available which mimic Fanuc or Haas interfaces.  The closest I've seen is an unreleased GUI a gent teased the forum with a couple years ago.  He mentioned that he might make it available to the LCNC community, but I suspect he's got enough work in to it that he (or his company) want to keep it to themselves.

forum.linuxcnc.org/show-your-stuff/47118...ing-some-work#254061

Another close GUI (in my opinion) was "Hazzy", but that's been abandoned for quite some time and won't work with current Linux or LCNC versions.  You can find archived Hazzy stuff on github and searching the forum for screenshots...even if only for ideas.

Gmoccapy is pretty close to commercial GUIs in concept with the bottom/side-row softkeys, but there are some features/quirks which deviate from my experience with commercial offerings.

Touchy has no on-screen jogging (nice) and is, I believe, designed for use with hardware controls.  But it's a little dated or sparse for some tastes.

With a bit of effort, however, you can get close(ish) without having to create a GUI from scratch.  Here's a shopping list of user-possible modifications which can make a GUI more commercial-feeling:

• Eliminate mouse
  • resistive touchscreen
  • trackball/trackpad in a panel-mount keyboard
• Dedicated hardware CNC function keys
  • Using a Mesa 7i73 and matrix keypad you can have (up to) 64 hardware keys programmed to do whatever you want.  Keys need not be physically in an 8x8 matrix - just electrically.
  • With some relegendable buttons or keys and a 3d printer you can create a CNC panel that's very close to whatever flavor Fanuc/Haas/Siemens you want.
  • There are plenty of other ways to get dedicated hardware buttons, but using the 7i73 means no USB latency and it's very easy to configure.
• Eliminate keyboard & screen-based jogging/motion
  • Most GUI programs have some ability to edit or restrict keybindings - it's just not obvious without digging.
  • Eliminating on-screen jogging is much harder - that takes editing the interface, although the QT-based screens make it somewhat easier.
  • Be prepared - getting rid of anything on every screen/tab which can cause motion is a monumental effort.  And even when you do get rid of everything, LCNC still doesn't behave like commercial controls.
    • On every commercial control I've used, the machine will not move unless you press cycle start (aside from hardware-button only jogging).  Probing screens, MDI, tool changes, everything... you must press cycle start to make the machine do something.
    • LCNC's ability to accept commands from external sources (python, GUI's, etc) means a GUI author can put a "G0 Z-infinity" button everywhere they want... and pressing that button will make the machine move.
• Look for a GUI which works with a 4:3 or 5:4 monitor
  • Most commercial GUI's aren't using wide-screen formats, so they don't try to fit everything on a single screen like most 16:9 LCNC GUI's do.  You may be more comfortable with a smaller real estate monitor and more screens to flip through... keeping the essentials on the main page.
• Tooltable
  • I don't know how to modify all LCNC GUI programs, but I know the QT and QTpy based ones can be modified as to which tool table columns are displayed.

The downside to creating or modifying a GUI is that updating LCNC or the GUI becomes tricky.  And creating a GUI from scratch is a monumental effort.

Hope that helps a little.

My Bosch cooktop freaks out with a drop of water; it's really annoying.

AFAIK, touchscreens basically work by detecting the water in your fingers (fingers, like most of the body, contain lotsa water); so actual water can triggger them.

However, water will likely break a mechanical keyboard/switch if not dried promptly.

(Membrane keyboards are probably fine.)
 

Resistive touchscreens have an outer flexible panel, a sheet of invisible contacts, and an inner glass layer.  When you press the outer surface the contacts in that location are physically closed and the computer registers a touch.  They generally can't do multi-touch, but they do work with gloves of any type and require a firm enough press that anything bouncing, hitting, or splashing on the screen is unlikely to activate it.

The other nice thing about resistive screens is that you can tape a sacrificial piece of clear plastic over the top to protect it.  Once that gets scratched or dirty, replace... and the touch function still works.

A membrane keyboard is certainly water/coolant resistant, but even if the contacts are rated for a billion presses the overlay wears out and then the whole thing is junk.  Also they may not have a great tactile feel, especially for typing.

There are some rather good waterproof panel-mount keyboards available these days, either from ebay or Aliexpress. Many configurations - with/without touchpads or trackballs, stainless fronts, different key combos.  The one I got recently has a stainless face and keys, but the actual tactile switches are under a continuous sheet of rubber - no water ingress.  I wouldn't want to type a novel on it, but it feels quite good for a very robust keyboard.

I have Cherry mx keyboard switches on my mill control panel and have had no issues with coolant or chips damaging the switches.  Unless the switch panel is horizontal (or nearly), any liquid splashing on the panel is likely to drain down before it gets to the switch contacts or mechanism.  What kills mechanical keyboards is dumping a quart of sugary soda on them until the mechanical bits are submerged and they get glued in place.

The proliferation of people making a living banging away on keyboards means there's been an explosion of mechanical keyboard parts, instructions, and related stuff available for a few years to consumers:

• Sockets for Cherry mx-type switches that solder to a perf board.  Meaning if a switch fails it's extremely easy to replace.
• Clear switch caps for inserting your own legends
• Multiple switch 'feel' varieties
• Aftermarket springs to stiffen up the action (even the stiffest 'stock' switch feels pretty limp compared to industrial pushbuttons)
• Vendors eager to machine/cast/print custom buttons
• Online keyboard layout generators with standardized key spacing and templates

You don't need to make a custom keyboard, a standard keyboard has losts of "useless" keys which you can repurpose for your needs.

 

"Need" has nothing to do with it.  GUI's and physical interfaces are deep in to the realm of personal preference... so there is no right answer for everyone.

If a body wants a user interface - screen and physical - which mimics typical industrial control panels then there is a certain layout, workflow, and feature-set they're likely to prefer.

I suspect that repurposing some keys on a standard keyboard is unlikely to tickle thier fancy.

Of course, everything I've posted above is based on my own preferences regarding CNC interfaces.

Im thinking I can send-cut-send a panel, with switches as desired, and use a keyboard USB "brain" to read them. then basically map them however needed at that point. that's the easier part for me. Learning the computer/software GUI stuff is gonna be a learning curve.

Kieran wrote:

Im thinking I can send-cut-send a panel, with switches as desired, and use a keyboard USB "brain" to read them. then basically map them however needed at that point. that's the easier part for me. Learning the computer/software GUI stuff is gonna be a learning curve.
 

S-C-S is a great idea.  And I sympathize with you about the software learning curve... 

What would be a short list of requirements for an industrial screen?
No axis movement without START button?
No graphics?
Mostly text styles or more modern graphical elements?
Multi function soft keys? Hardware only keys.
What target monitor size?
Etc.

for me personally its mostly the ability to use physical buttons to navigate instead of a mouse. the backplot is cool but could be relegated to its own screen mode with perhaps absolute/distance-to-go ("position" screen on fanuc for example). Offsets, both work and tool, should have their own dedicated screen toggled by an "offsets" physical button. with ability to use arrow keys to navigate the columns and enter values. physical heavy duty tactile cycle start and stop buttons are a must for powerful machines, as sometimes time is of the essence when its plunging toward doom.

I actually really like the functionality of the arrow keys and pgUP and pgDN for jogging linuxcnc. Just mapping those keys to physically beefier switches for jogging would be great. A Proper real life feed rate over ride knob is great too. I actually use it more than feed hold on the Fanucs. I can turn feed all the way down, hit cycle start, then use the feed to "drive" the machine carefully when needed.