Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit

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07 Oct 2021 21:30 - 07 Oct 2021 21:33 #222493 by nduerr
Hi All!  This is my first attempt at a retrofit.  My Bostomatic 400-2 is a 4 axes, 2 spindle (4000rpm & 30000 High speed), 16 turret tool changer model.  Luckily it was converted to a PC control back in 2004, however in March I had a servo amp fail and it must have back feed back into one of the proprietary boards and/or the PC control boards of which I can't find replacements.  (Bostomatic and the Retrofit company are out of business).
I have all schematics for the original and retrofit so that is helpful.   I am planning on reusing as much as possible of the original equipment initially and upgrade when I can.Luckily, with the earlier PC conversion, all the relay and control items were run through 2-24 port WRC Acron (similar to opto-22 boards) that I believe will plug directly into a mesa board.  If I am not correct about this let me know!  I would like to keep my Servos and spindles on different boards so the upgrade track will be simpler.   I’m not set on the control panel interface, I am willing to replace the pots with rotary mpgs if they are easier to work with for the manual overrides, suggestions are welcome!I have been going through the Mesa selection and I have come up with 3 configurations that would like to get some feedback on.  They are all roughly the same price, so I am looking for performance benefits and or LinuxCNC programing/mapping benefits. 
Option 1:
Mesa 5I24----WRC1
              
WRC2
              
Mesa 7I44 ----7I69
7I48
4 Servo Drives with Encoders with 2 extra
                                                  
7I33TA
Main Spindle & HS Spindle
                                      
7I69
7I42TA
Control Panel interface
                                                                        6 on/off switches, 5 position rotary switch
                                                                        1 MPG, 3 Potentiometers 2 spindles & feed manual 
                                                                       overrides (I’m not sure if this card can take 5kohm pots)

Option 2:
Mesa 7I94
7I69
WRC1
                           
WRC2
              
7I69
7I48
4 Servo Drives with Encoders with 2 extra
                          
7I33TA
Main Spindle & HS Spindle
              
7I69
7I42TA
Control Panel interface
                                                6 on/off switches, 5 position rotary switch
                                                1 MPG, 3 Potentiometers 2 spindles & feed manual
                                                overrides (I’m not sure if this card can take 5kohm pots)

Option 3:
Mesa 7I80
7I48
4 Servo Drives with Encoders with 2 extra
               
7I33TA
Main Spindle & HS Spindle
                
7I44
7I69
WRC1
                                       
WRC2
                           
7I69
7I42TA
Control Panel interface
                                                             6 on/off switches, 5 position rotary switch
                                                            1 MPG, 3 Potentiometers 2 spindles & feed
                                                            manual overrides (I’m not sure if this card can take 5kohm pots)

What does everyone think?
Thanks for the help!
Last edit: 07 Oct 2021 21:33 by nduerr.

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07 Oct 2021 23:36 #222503 by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
My most recent conversion used a 5i24. It's a great device at a good price with lots of pins.

I would tend towards one of your options that includes a 7i44 (or 7i74) as the easiest way to wire your control panel is to put a 7i73 in there and run one CAT5 cable back to the main control box.

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07 Oct 2021 23:46 #222504 by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
One suggestion for OPTO22 interfaces: a 7I90HD
We have no 7I69 stock and it will be a long time
before we can build them again

A7I90HD with sserial remote firmware can
interface to 3x 24 I/O OPTO22 modules

The only real feature it lacks compared to
the 7I69 is that it does not have the reversed
I/O numbering option that the 7I96 has

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12 Oct 2021 19:35 #222962 by nduerr
Replied by nduerr on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
Thanks PCW & andypugh,
I am leaning towards the 7I94, 2X 7I90HD for 7I48, 7I33 & 2 WRC connections.
For the panel I am looking at the 7I73.
My main concern is the 3 potentiometers. It looks like the 7I73 has 3 analog inputs, will these work well for the pots?
Also, are there breakout boards for the 2x20 & 2x17 header plugs?

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12 Oct 2021 20:04 #222967 by andypugh
Replied by andypugh on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit

My main concern is the 3 potentiometers. It looks like the 7I73 has 3 analog inputs, will these work well for the pots?

It has 4 analogue inputs, numbered 0 to 3. 

They read to 8 bits, ie 0 to 255 on a 3.3V range. So should be fine if you want to stay with potentiometers. You might want to consider swapping the potentiometers for encoders, though. (there are many 16-click encoders available in the same format as potentiometers) as encoders "play better" with other signal sources. A potentiometer, being absolute, always has to "win". 
 

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12 Oct 2021 20:05 #222968 by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
There is no way to get 7I33 or 7I48 support for the 7I90HD in SSerial mode

I would suggest

1 7I94 (ethernet SSerial linterface + 1 25 pin expansion connector)
1 or 2 7I83 (analog +-10V out) (SSerial)
1 7I89 (8 channel encoder interface on 7I94 parallel expansion)
1 7I73 (front panel interface, SSerial)
1 7I90HD (OPTO22 interface, SSerial)

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13 Oct 2021 13:18 #223022 by nduerr
Replied by nduerr on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
The options are getting sifted down!
PCW what are your thoughts on this config, similar to option 3 above?
1 7I80HD
1 7I48 Axis servo control w/ encoders
1 7I33 Spindle control
1 7I44 (8channel ethernet SSerial interface)
1 7I73 (front panel interface, SSerial)
1 7I90HD (OPTO22 interface, SSerial)

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13 Oct 2021 14:57 #223028 by PCW
Replied by PCW on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
I t should work but lacks some advantages
(analog out isolation, simpler cabling)
and is more expensive than my suggestion

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18 Oct 2021 13:32 #223452 by JR1050
Replied by JR1050 on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
I usually use a 7i84 for the operator controls, I think I used it because it has screw terminal blocks . have had issues trying to use analog pots for things like feed over ride, since you can’t exactly get the analog to digital conversion perfect, it eats up a ton of real-time cpu and lcnc doesn’t seem to function properly, that was the explanation that I had read in another thread. What is the pc control that you are removing?

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19 Oct 2021 14:28 #223562 by nduerr
Replied by nduerr on topic Bostomatic 400-2 Retrofit
It was converted to MDSI OpenCNC (now Hurco) in the early 2000's. Both Bostomatic and the Integrator are out of business so no help there.
As far as I can tell with what testing I can do, the A to D board is working but the encoder board is not working, and they are so old that I cant find any used replacements. When I turn it on, all the axes run to their limits... so conversion it is!

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